Author Topic: 1993 20 oz Gold Peacock 1500 Yuan Two Peacocks - Help informing Chinese buyers?  (Read 3741 times)

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Offline Vincentd123

Hello, I realize this is a bit last minute notice, however, in i have consigned my 1993 20 oz gold 1500 yuan two peacocks coin with heritage auctions, and it Will be auctioned off on December 8th in the world coins Hong Kong auction. I realize that this may not be the best market to be a seller of this coin, and having had this coin for 20+ years i wish i was able to hold on to it for a few more years, but my financial situation is leaving me no choice. I know the auction house has done a slew of advertising for me. They listed the coin as the "featured" item of the auction, as well as put the coin on the cover of the catalog. I tried hiring a few PR firms in HK to help me with further advertising, but none of the agencies felt like they could be of any help. I know this coin is a symbol of marriage in the Chinese culture, and is one of the most prestigious wedding gifts one can give. I was hoping to find a way to get the names and contact information of any super wealthy Chinese who have announced any intentions of getting marries, as well as the names and contact information of any collectors or rare MCC. Can anyone assist in obtaining any of this contact information?

https://coins.ha.com/itm/china/world-coins/china-people-s-republic-gold-peacock-proof-1500-yuan-20-oz-1993-pr68-ultra-cameo-ngc-/a/3050-37253.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515
 

Offline badon

Hello, I realize this is a bit last minute notice, however, in i have consigned my 1993 20 oz gold 1500 yuan two peacocks coin with heritage auctions, and it Will be auctioned off on December 8th in the world coins Hong Kong auction. I realize that this may not be the best market to be a seller of this coin, and having had this coin for 20+ years i wish i was able to hold on to it for a few more years, but my financial situation is leaving me no choice. I know the auction house has done a slew of advertising for me. They listed the coin as the "featured" item of the auction, as well as put the coin on the cover of the catalog. I tried hiring a few PR firms in HK to help me with further advertising, but none of the agencies felt like they could be of any help. I know this coin is a symbol of marriage in the Chinese culture, and is one of the most prestigious wedding gifts one can give. I was hoping to find a way to get the names and contact information of any super wealthy Chinese who have announced any intentions of getting marries, as well as the names and contact information of any collectors or rare MCC. Can anyone assist in obtaining any of this contact information?

https://coins.ha.com/itm/china/world-coins/china-people-s-republic-gold-peacock-proof-1500-yuan-20-oz-1993-pr68-ultra-cameo-ngc-/a/3050-37253.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515

Welcome to CCF, Vincentd123! That is quite a bombshell you just dropped on us. Congratulations on your incredibly profitable long-term investment in the modern Chinese coins (MCC) market. I know many of the wealthiest collectors in China via my association with them in their pursuit of Classical Gardens coins. I will share this information with them, and they will tell their friends about this coin. There are almost 600 people that participate in the Classical Gardens QQ group, mostly from Shanghai. All of them are sophisticated appreciators of China's art and culture, and I'm sure some of them will be interested in this auction.
 

Offline badon

I have a plan for informing interested people about this auction. It will take me some time to implement it, but it  won't cost you anything, and I'm guessing as many as 10'000 people will be able to see this by the time the auction date arrives. Please ask for help as soon as possible next time you sell something like this. I'm sure there will be many interested people, but raising $200'000 to $400'000 by the time of the auction might not be possible for all of them, with such short notice. I will do what I can for you, and we'll see how it goes. This is a coin that is necessary to complete my own collection of peacocks and other marriage-theme coins :)
 

Offline Vincentd123

Badon, thank you very much for your fast reply. My appreciation for your help is unmesurable. I wish i thought of using this outlet sooner. I consigned the coin for auction almost 6 months ago. I do believe the auction house gives the winning bidder an additional 30 days to make their payment after the auction is complete, which essentially can buy some more time.
 
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Offline badon

 

Offline badon

Badon, thank you very much for your fast reply. My appreciation for your help is unmesurable. I wish i thought of using this outlet sooner. I consigned the coin for auction almost 6 months ago. I do believe the auction house gives the winning bidder an additional 30 days to make their payment after the auction is complete, which essentially can buy some more time.

Can you verify that for sure? Verifying that bit of information and any other important details could make the difference between someone bidding or not bidding. I think it might require special arrangements with the auction house to get those payment terms. Basically, the auction house doesn't want to turn away the #2 bidder and then months later end up not getting paid by the #1 bidder. In my experience high-end auction houses are very eager to have people bidding on their auctions, so they're probably going to make it as easy and painless as possible to work out a deal for payment. Last time I used special payment arrangements, nothing special had to be done. I just had to agree to their payment plan, and make my payments on time, then the coins were mine.
 

Offline Vincentd123

Badon, i will discuss the terms thoroughly with the auction house first thing in the morning, and give you a solidifed answer as soon as possible. I also sent you a private message.
 

Offline badon

OK, I responded to your PM. Also, if you have any other photos, please post them. I'm going to post the photos around the internet as eye candy for people who will enjoy seeing something impressive. Some of those people may decide to bid on it if they like the photos. The more photos you have, the better. People love coin eye candy.
 

Offline Vincentd123

More pictures
 

Offline badon

This topic has already been viewed 50 times in the last few hours, and I haven't even started telling anyone about it yet. It was a good idea to post all those beautiful photos.
 

Offline trouble

wow what a good one. However, as you say it is not a right time. Economy uncertain in Asia will lead to lower price in auction.
 
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Offline Vincentd123

wow what a good one. However, as you say it is not a right time. Economy uncertain in Asia will lead to lower price in auction.

Yes, but waiting for the economy to stabalize in Asia could take a few years. Especially for it to return to its 2011/2012 peak. In that amount of time, if properly invested, the profits from the sale of this coin could superceed the money that could be made waiting around to sell this coin until the perfect economic circumstances arise.
 

Offline Vincentd123

wow what a good one. However, as you say it is not a right time. Economy uncertain in Asia will lead to lower price in auction.

Badon, to show you how long ive been contemplating this sale and looking into things, heres a link to another thread i started around 6 months ago on another forum. Also i responed to your pm. Im a bit confused, maybe you can clarify things for me. Thank you!

Code: [Select]
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=12632.15
Edit by badon: china-mint.info censured. Censured does not mean censored (censorship).
« Last Edit: 2016 Nov 26, 04:41:10 AM by badon »
 

Offline trouble

wow what a good one. However, as you say it is not a right time. Economy uncertain in Asia will lead to lower price in auction.

Yes, but waiting for the economy to stabalize in Asia could take a few years. Especially for it to return to its 2011/2012 peak. In that amount of time, if properly invested, the profits from the sale of this coin could superceed the money that could be made waiting around to sell this coin until the perfect economic circumstances arise.

Understood your point. You want to get turnaround
 

Offline badon

wow what a good one. However, as you say it is not a right time. Economy uncertain in Asia will lead to lower price in auction.

Yes, but waiting for the economy to stabalize in Asia could take a few years. Especially for it to return to its 2011/2012 peak. In that amount of time, if properly invested, the profits from the sale of this coin could superceed the money that could be made waiting around to sell this coin until the perfect economic circumstances arise.

Understood your point. You want to get turnaround

I agree. I think the right thing to do is to let the big impressive coin go to someone who can afford to collect many of them, and then chase the profitable fun and excitement in the cheaper coins. A few of them are similar in rarity to the big gold peacock, but they are so cheap they could easily double in value and no one would be surprised nor afraid to buy it. Big gold is notorious for failing to get respectable numismatic value above their bullion value, and although that does not apply to small sets like the peacocks, any very expensive item of any kind (houses, etc) can be difficult to sell for top values simply because fewer people are able to afford them. It would be shocking news if a $200k item suddenly doubled in value, and many people would feel uncomfortable buying it after that.

This peacock is only worth keeping if you're obsessed with completing a set of peacocks. For most people, profits in less expensive coins are more appealing. I collect the peacocks, and although I can appreciate jaw-dropping beauty of the big gold peacocks, I view it as a luxury item that I cannot personally afford to indulge in. Thus, I prefer cheaper and more profitable coins so that someday maybe I will be able to afford sink tons of idle cash into coins like that.

I don't think I've ever had more than about $20'000 to $30'000 in a single coin, and I've never actually paid more than about $8000 for a single coin. Lately, my limit for new purchases has been around $3000, which I spent on a 2014 30 g gold baby panda. Most of my new purchases during 2015 and 2016 have been between $50 and $800 for a single coin. Before 2015, I was spending more than $1000 an single coins pretty often, but market conditions changed, and it was no longer necessary to spend that much money to get a very nice coin. Some will say prices went down, others will say buying opportunities went up. Glass half-full, glass half-empty. Potato, potahtoe.

I know where this market is going, and I've continued to buy during all market conditions. 1993 was a time when people were making lots of money in the stock market, and nobody wanted to make big investments in precious metals and coins. Vincentd123 bought the "cheap Chinese junk" anyway, and now he's selling it for a king's ransom! Things like this are what excite people's imaginations. It's a lot of fun to watch the market, and then reflect on the fact that I'm here too! I bought silver for $3 to $4 per oz around the same time you bought your peacock, and sold it for approximately double what I paid for it during a brief spike that happened back then, before the Dotcom boom took off around 1996.

Ah, the memories...
 

Offline pandamonium

There is a post on Chinese Coin Forum that China now has 400 $billionaires.    How many multi $millionaires?     Makes sense that someone over there would pay racing pigeon prices for it.     IF my property sold i would buy it in a heartbeat.........
 
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Offline Vincentd123

There is a post on Chinese Coin Forum that China now has 400 $billionaires.    How many multi $millionaires?     Makes sense that someone over there would pay racing pigeon prices for it.     IF my property sold i would buy it in a heartbeat.........

Hello, would you mind posting a link here to that forum you just mentioned? Thank you!
 

Offline badon

Vincentd123, let me know when you have decided whether to continue with the auction of your peacock or not. If you decide to continue as as planned, I can start telling potentially interested people in my social network about it.
 

Offline badon

There is a post on Chinese Coin Forum that China now has 400 $billionaires.    How many multi $millionaires?     Makes sense that someone over there would pay racing pigeon prices for it.     IF my property sold i would buy it in a heartbeat.........

Hello, would you mind posting a link here to that forum you just mentioned? Thank you!

I found the info on this forum:

Re: MCC LIST #183, move from LBC and continuation here at the CC forum
 

Offline Vincentd123

Vincentd123, let me know when you have decided whether to continue with the auction of your peacock or not. If you decide to continue as as planned, I can start telling potentially interested people in my social network about it.


Badon, yes i will continue with the auction as planned. Thank you. Your help will not go unreciprocated.

Edit by badon: Fixed quote.
« Last Edit: 2016 Dec 04, 08:23:41 PM by badon »
 

Offline Vincentd123

Badon, also, are there any other forums you would advise me joining and posting about this in? Thank you.
 

Offline Vincentd123

Vincentd123, let me know when you have decided whether to continue with the auction of your peacock or not. If you decide to continue as as planned, I can start telling potentially interested people in my social network about it.


Badon, have you spread the news? If so how does the response look?
 

Offline badon

So sorry, I missed your response. I'll get right to it! In the future, and for anyone reading this, please send me a PM if you don't receive a prompt response to an important issue, and keep sending them until you reach me.
 
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Offline badon

These links show the original artwork by Giuseppe Castiglione, ordered by the Emperor in 1758:

Images, Knowledge and Empire: Depicting Cassowaries in the Qing Court | Lai | Transcultural Studies - Two Peacocks by Giuseppe Castiglione

File:Peacock Spreads Its Tail.jpg - Wikimedia Commons

The original painting still exists. It was looted by the losing side at the end of the Chinese civil war, and taken to Taiwan, where the rebel government that overthrew the Emperor in 1911 fled after defeat by Mao Zedong's forces in 1949. The fact the original artwork is in the possession of a bitter enemy, and the People's Republic of China (PRC) still decided to put it on coinage, is an incredible display of the political importance of the 1993 coins.
 
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Offline badon

 

Offline badon

This discussion got a lot more interesting after someone noticed the connections to the painting on their own:

0belvedere comments on 1993 20 oz gold peacock certified NGC 68, mintage 66, in Heritage auction Wednesday December 7th, estimate $200'000 to $250'000

It's amazing how smart people can be, to see something they've never seen before, and instantly recognize its importance. Wow! That's what happens when you get a lot of eyes on something important. Somebody out there will see what everyone else overlooks.